We have been ProWorx32/Quantum users for a long time, and now considering using the M340 which requires Unity. I am looking for some feedback on a few questions.

1. How is Unity? Is it stable, does it have the functionality that you want?

2. How is the M340 - has it been reliable?

3. Unity does not seem to support "Source Control" as ProWorx32 does. How do you do Source Control?

Thank you.

 

We have used Proworx for years and switched to Unity Pro and were very disappointed with the complexity and sharp learning curve.

In the LADDER screens:

No online programming, you must recompile (build), stop the processor, download and run the program.

No state display, only flow display in logic

Increased complexity talking to an HMI as well using their recommended software.

After the fact we were informed that the M340 CAN be programmed with Proworx32…

Check with someone that is NOT trying to make you switch as your skilled trades will need to be retrained as well if you switch to Unity Pro software.

The first processor we received would not communicate with the laptop and one ethernet communication module would not work.

These problems were right out of the box.

Not a good first impression

I hope this helps,
William Hinton

 

Hi

I don't agree to the above

You can do online ladder (or any other) changes without stopping the plc. They are also animated just fine

Wrt HMI you can use Schneider's OPC server directly, this is not very difficult. Personally I dislike OPC, so i tend to use modbus. In this case you have to assign an address to each variable you want in your HMI. I still gather its an efficient enough workflow, as it is easier to work with internal variables without an assigned address. I also use a script that assigns all variables an address and creates the import file for my HMI.

All in all i prefer Unity to PL7 and Siemens step 7, the other tools i use a lot.

Even so, my biggest dislikes are:

- more cumbersome ladder input by keyboard

- tcpip driver doesn't show io state correctly, you must use xip like pl7 which is more difficult to set up

- state diagrams were more intuitive in pl7, and faster to write

I also have some colleagues that report that unity has a steeper learning curve. I don't really understand why. Perhaps a tad more complex than pl7, but certainly a lot simpler than step 7.

So in sum, unity is not perfect, but i recommend it

 

As a Schneider employee and a long time user of both Unity and M340 I must take exception to your comments.

We have thousands of systems installed, in various applications, all running without issue and with great user acceptance.

I have supported many users and done many interactive seminars on these products and your opinions are not shared by the users of both products.

I must assume that you received poor instruction and/or guidance on using these products.

1. State indication (on or off) is available in LD sections (Green ON, Red OFF). All sections and languages are automatically and simultaneously animated.

2. On line programming is totally functional. Make a change, compile the change, all when online in RUN. No stop required. In fact, you can build new function blocks and datatypes while online and in run.

3.HMI interface is the same as any PLC. Configure the HMI and address the required PLC points. If the use of IEC topological addressing
is causing confusion then you can always use the older Modbus style of addressing with the M340. Just remember that Modbus addresses start at 1 and IEC start at 0. If you are using the Magelis HMI then all HMI to PLC interface have made easier.

4. You have been misled. There is NO WAY to program a M340 using Proworx 32. Currently, you can use a PW32 project in Unity with the Quantum controllers without the need for conversion. This feature is currently in development for the M340, but not yet available.

5. What communications did not work to connect the "out of the box" controller with your PC? The Ethernet ports on any "new" module will not be configured. It is necessary to download some sort of configuration to set the IP addresses. This is why the USB driver is available. No parity, baud rate, stop bits or protocol to worry about.

I am sorry that you had such a bad experience and again, I must assume that you have not received proper support. I would be pleased to help you resolve your issues.

 

Thank you for your reasoned response. I read and have thought about both the first responder and the Schneider employee. Your response was in the middle which seemed about right.

Does anyone use source control products?

 

William I don't want to be rude but seriously the things you said have never been an issue on unity since day 1. I have never had the problems you mentioned and have been working with unity since it was released

To the OP
To me its very user friendly and was easy to learn coming from other vendors.

If I was you I would ask your local Schneider agent to arrange a demonstration for you and you can decide for yourself.

 

I've found the software not at all intuitive, the setting of a network IP address is not demonstrated in the help files.

I was forced away from Proworx which wasn’t great but I knew most of the work-arounds.

The help file themselves are cumbersome and full of jargon.

The installation is a nightmare; it installs 600Mb of "foreign" languages. I've only ever used English so I should have the choice, but it doesn't give you one. If you delete them manually afterwards it reinstalls them!!

I've used loads of plc programming languages but this isn't in the top ten.

As for M340 there seems to be trouble with supply of some parts (connectors!! Which is pretty lame considering that a plc is useless without them?)

I’m thinking of moving my main programming / hardware over to Siemens.

 

I will agree that setting up a network is not intuitive, but that is why people attend seminars or training for new products. Three steps for Ethernet networks... add network, configure the network, assign the network to a module (port).

As for the languages, what?? Did you install ALL of them?

M340 module connectors, yes there are different types but this is to suit project requirements (screw clamp, push in, etc). The same connector, whatever type, fits almost all of the modules.

Unity software is fantastic and versatile. Lots of online features make it likely you will never have to stop a controller to make changes. And compatibility between versions and controller revisions further reduces the necessity to ever stop a controller. Features not found in many other software packages.

 

> Does anyone use source control products?

I tend to use git for source control. Reasons: free open source, does not require server installation, fast(est?), works on site with no network connection (still with branches etc), and if you need them som really advanced functions

Problem is that git and other such systems are text based, so when using a system like unity that generates a single binary project file, you lose diffs between revisions, compression, merging of branches and so on. A tool called unitydoff may alleviate this, but i haven't tried it as it is licensed

I still like git though, to maintain a revision history, backup while working, copying between machines, and branching for doing large chunks of work on one branch while easily having access to the 'online' version if necessary