What type of DCS to Chose?


Thread Starter


Which DCS to chose for formaldehyde and resin production?

Main information:
- HART was used for all control equipment (valves, transmitters and etc) used analog signal.
- Basic open/close valves used discrete signal.
- MCC and all drives soft-starting equipment used profibus and simacode of Siemens.
Used equipment (and probably is going to be used):
- Emerson (transmitters , sensors)
- ABB (drives, pumps)
- Siemens (dosing machines)
- ABB, EATON (CB and other protection devices)
Previous installed was DeltaV. Now proposed are ABB, Yokogawa, Siemens.

What you can suggest ? Which one is better, cheaper?

Thank you!
Why in the world would you want to replace a DeltaV control system? With the information supplied, I would try to use the DeltaV and expand it where necessary. You do not indicate if this is a batch process, but I assume it is. Emerson has excellent batch software for the DeltaV. There is nothing wrong with any of the other systems, but if you want a supplier to assume total responsibility for the system, then either use a local system integrator, or Siemens, which has a history of taking full responsibility, but is not cheap.
I presume that you have Delta V in your existing plant and are adding those 2 new plants?

I would recommend that you use Delta V again. It is what you know and it is as good as or better than your other options.

All new DCS systems like Delta V or Experion PKS have a similar cost.
The extra cost of supporting 2 different DCS platforms should also be avoided.

good luck
Not exactly. New plants ain't gonna be connected with the previous two. Moreover, different DCS have been implemented in different plants.

So, supporting costs are not expected.

Last time ABB, Siemens and Yokogawa were suggested, but Honeywell and others are not eliminated . That's why I'm asking which one do you think is cheaper, easy operating and maintained. Or with which one you've got previous experience.

Thank you!
I'm not sure it is batch system or not. But something is went wrong with it. I've just entered the project and need to modificate existing plant and shortly "switch DeltaV for another one". Priority are cheaper, easy commissioning.

I'm open for any suggestions or questions.

Thank you!
There are no significant differences in cost among any of the DCS suppliers you named. All of them compete with each other. They are all easy to use, if you take their training programs, but they are different. Most of the users I know, use either Emerson DeltaV or Honeywell Experion. Dow Chemical has standardized on ABB x800A. But all of these are in North America. Local support means a great deal.

Most of the small batch chemical plants in North America use Rockwell's Process Logix with their batch software. They tell me that they save money this way.
>Which DCS to chose for formaldehyde and resin production?

I just wanted to add to Dick's answer. "DCS" can be an ambiguous term. Some just using the term/acronym for sales purposes or lack of knowledge, etc.

So I just wanted to say if your old 'DCS' system is one of those proprietary circuit ones where you have to pay if you want more timers or pid functions, etc.; take the opportunity to upgrade to a system that just uses PACs and SCADA software. (no charge to add timers, pid, etc. A system like Dick describes in his reply, but can bee any brand that best works for you. Doesn't have to be Controllogix/FactoryTalk, can be Siemens brand, etc.) You will save a lot in future downtime cost, site changes and support cost.
Hi Assylbek,

All of features that were mentioned above (HART, Profibus, etc) is a are a standard features of modern Control System from major vendor such as Emerson, ABB, Rockwell Automation. So what I can suggest not to based on the brand or vendor, but since formaldehyde and resin plant is a batch control based based chemical process, you will need batch process control system that complied with ISA-88.

ISA-88 Batch control standard is designed to: "Provide standards and recommended practices as appropriate for the design and specification of batch control systems as used in the process control industries."

The ISA88 standard provides a structure for batch processes that breaks tasks down into their smallest controllable parts and assembles a recipe based on those components. ISA-88 batch process management allows you to reuse programming code, recipes, phases and units for processes with similar procedures which allows for an abbreviated effort when expanding a system or in systems where there are multiple instances of like equipment such as mixers, reactors, scales, storage tanks, etc.

Delta-V batch process control system already based on ISA-88 standard so you can simply kept to use Delta-V since this is what your operations and maintenance team already experienced with and to avoid the extra cost of supporting 2 different DCS platforms.

If you are considering cost, Rockwell Automation batch system will be an options since they are also implemented ISA-88 on their batch control system with cheaper cost than traditional DCS vendor such as Delta V and ABB

Hope this my two cents will help