CSA questioning glenmorangie to allow idiots to start a turbine without a proper AC turning gear motor that allows the proper cooldown sequence after turbine is shutdown.
My answer is SURE start it. The cranking motor protection relay may need to have the protection settings changed. GO FOR IT.
All this from the question of a poster that only wanted to know if the cranking motor can start the thing from near zero speed.
Is this a trick question??????????????
Hallelujah !!Curious_One,
I worked with a man many years ago who had a VERY difficult time turning over operation to the operators at a plant. (I actually did more than one commissioning with him.) He just had no confidence that they knew how to operate the unit--and we all know that's the case at most new power plants. Hell, experienced operators melt away into the woodwork when a controls retrofit/upgrade is done--they think START doesn't mean START, and AUTO doesn't mean AUTO, and RAISE- or LOWER SPEED/LOAD don't do the same thing they did before. And, they don't want to be told what to do--but they're afraid to do what they've done before, too. It's almost comical.
If you think one has to know EVERY bit of code and logic before starting a machine, no one should be operating a machine. No one.
As engineers/technicians, especially engineers/technicians that have the responsibility to commission new turbine-generators which are under warranty by the OEM, we are probably more frightened than anyone about proper operation (well most, anyway; not all, but that's a different thread...!).
Yeah, I should have said if the unit is under manufacturer's warranty or an LTSA you should be asking this question of the warrantor or the LTSA provider. And, maybe the reason the question (poorly worded as it was) was meant to get a "second opinion" because there was some clarification required or needed.
If you tap out--no tap backs!
I have my answer. Right or wrong, I have it. I have formulated my own answer without the benefit of seeing the programming for the Mark* or the P&ID for the Starting Means system. It may be right, or it may be wrong. But it was based on the information provided by the original poster (scarce as it was), and our exchanges, Curious_One. The original poster (if he's even still following this thread) can use my answer as he sees fit, or not.
Operators, and Operations Supervisors, and Plant Managers, and Plant Engineers should be capable of looking at the START-CHECK permissive display and referring to the P&IDs and the System Descriptions in the Operations & Maintenance Manuals and making some informed decisions. We won't know what the original poster's duties or responsibilities are, or even what prompted the question. Without more information, there's nothing more can be done.
Blessed day.
Hallelujah !!Curious_One,
I worked with a man many years ago who had a VERY difficult time turning over operation to the operators at a plant. (I actually did more than one commissioning with him.) He just had no confidence that they knew how to operate the unit--and we all know that's the case at most new power plants. Hell, experienced operators melt away into the woodwork when a controls retrofit/upgrade is done--they think START doesn't mean START, and AUTO doesn't mean AUTO, and RAISE- or LOWER SPEED/LOAD don't do the same thing they did before. And, they don't want to be told what to do--but they're afraid to do what they've done before, too. It's almost comical.
If you think one has to know EVERY bit of code and logic before starting a machine, no one should be operating a machine. No one.
As engineers/technicians, especially engineers/technicians that have the responsibility to commission new turbine-generators which are under warranty by the OEM, we are probably more frightened than anyone about proper operation (well most, anyway; not all, but that's a different thread...!).
Yeah, I should have said if the unit is under manufacturer's warranty or an LTSA you should be asking this question of the warrantor or the LTSA provider. And, maybe the reason the question (poorly worded as it was) was meant to get a "second opinion" because there was some clarification required or needed.
If you tap out--no tap backs!
I have my answer. Right or wrong, I have it. I have formulated my own answer without the benefit of seeing the programming for the Mark* or the P&ID for the Starting Means system. It may be right, or it may be wrong. But it was based on the information provided by the original poster (scarce as it was), and our exchanges, Curious_One. The original poster (if he's even still following this thread) can use my answer as he sees fit, or not.
Operators, and Operations Supervisors, and Plant Managers, and Plant Engineers should be capable of looking at the START-CHECK permissive display and referring to the P&IDs and the System Descriptions in the Operations & Maintenance Manuals and making some informed decisions. We won't know what the original poster's duties or responsibilities are, or even what prompted the question. Without more information, there's nothing more can be done.
Blessed day.
