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Hi, all,
Yesterday morning, I received (yet) another Direct/Personal Message from someone via Control.com, someone named Taza. It is the SECOND time he wrote via Direct/Personal Messsage for help with the SAME problem. Anyway, he wrote:
"Mark VIe control system is new for me.
One GT controllers ( TMR ) are showing Not Equal Sign and not allowing to force any signal.
Can you help me out, how to resolve this issue."
Taza,
It's unclear what the application is (turbine--gas or steam; DCS/BOP; etc.), or what kind of Mark VIe you are working on (a Mark VIe, or a Mark V-to-Mark VIe Life Extension, or a Mark VI-to-Mark VIe platform upgrade, etc.). The differences ARE important.
It's also unclear exactly where the "Not Equal Sign" is appearing. A screen capture or screen shot or a CLEAR photograph posted to a proper thread--NOT A DIRECT- OR PRIVATE MESSAGE--would be very helpful. In fact, with regard to your problem: Some more information--which could be clearly shown in a screen shot or CLEAR photo--is absolutely necessary.
Lastly, why the HELL do you need to force anything???!?!!!?!?! If you're new to Mark VIe, then you probably shouldn't be forcing anything, and someone is probably telling you that something needs to be forced or had been forced in the past. And how do you know that person is correct? How do you know that what you are forcing is the proper way to deal with the issue which is occurring? Did you force something before to solve an issue? And now you think you need to force that same thing again? If you, or someone, forced something before to solve a "similar" (or even the same) issue--tell us that information.
Are you using the same HMI as before to force this thing which just must be forced? If not, why not? Tell us as much information about the situation and circumstances as possible.
I hear this all the time: "The LAST time this happened, we had to force [this or that]!" On a Mark* turbine control system (which, according to many people is the root of all evil!) EVERY problem is like the LAST problem, even if it's not. (And 99.3% of the time, this problem is NOT like the LAST problem.) People just do not think about this problem, or the LAST problem--they just blame the Mark* for EVERY problem, which is just like the LAST problem. Why? Because the Mark* is SO complicated and SO user-unfriendly and SO mysterious that it must be the cause of EVERY single problem, so that makes EVERY problem which comes up just like the LAST problem.
Forcing is not the answer to every problem--or even most problems. Just like "calibrating" servos or fuel control valves is not the answer to every problem, or even most problems. Or replacing a servo when the unit tripped for no apparent reason.
Most people don't have a friggin' clue about GE-design heavy duty gas turbine systems and devices and operation and operating and control philosophy. (That's somewhat understandable; GE documentation is pretty bad, but it's not horrible--not always, anyway.) They don't refer to P&IDs--many won't even try (which is surprising because GE P&IDs are about the simplest and best P&IDs around). All of which makes the Mark* even more of a monster and the cause of all problems. Everything (well, not everything, but most everything) is connected to the Mark*, right? So, it must be the cause of all problems--and because the Mark* is the cause of all problems then EVERY problem is like the LAST problem and it can be fixed or worked around or ignored by forcing something. That is the popular, but mostly untrue, belief.
There are any number of reasons why a not equal sign might appear in different places in ToolboxST (which is NOT the Mark VIe--ToolboxST is just the application which is used to program, monitor and troubleshoot the Mark VIe). If there's a not equal sign somewhere, then someone has done something they shouldn't have--and without understanding what was done, it's very difficult to be of much help. BUT, a CLEAR picture or a screen shot attached to a thread would go a LONG ways towards beginning to be able to provide some help.
To Taza and everyone else reading this thread:
To receive help with any issue or request for information you need to open a proper thread in Control.com. YES, I know--the number of possible forums is intimidating and because there is little moderation--and because the moderators can't know precisely where every thread should be placed--threads sometimes end up in the most unlikely of forums and areas. Just pick a forum. If it's egregiously wrong, a moderator will move it (though I can count on one hand the number of threads I know of which have been moved in 15 years--it rarely happens, or if it does it's not made widely known to the readers of the forum). So, pick a forum--a good one for this question would be "Control Systems and HMIs" or "Power" or, if the turbine is a generator drive for a power plant, "Utilities." But, pick one--and post your question there.
Why? Because the Direct- or Personal Message feature of the new Control.com IS NOT FOR FINDING YOUR OWN PERSONAL FREE SOURCE OF HELP AND INFORMATION! By being selfish and posting your request for help to someone using the Direct- or Personal Messaging feature of Control.com you are depriving others of the information you are asking for. That's one of the very best things about forums like Control.com--the fact that prior threads and questions and requests for information are all archived and can be searched and valuable information can be found. And, the thing that makes Control.com such a valuable forum among so many other similar forums is that people write back with feedback to let others know if the information provided to them was useful or not. That way, when others read the thread--now or in the future--they will know what worked and what didn't.
By writing directly to someone and asking for help with your question you are preventing others from seeing the information and the chance to learn from it and use it. AND, the individual who might answer your question is spending his/her time writing an individual response that will never be seen or shared by others. And, most of us get paid exactly the same amount as you paid when you post your question to Control.com: Nothing. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Niente. Why would anyone waste his/her time and effort on one person when the same amount of time and effort can help many people? I'm not here to be anyone's personal mentor or guide or guru or instructor, when I can be that to many people. The goal here is to help people--but to help many people, not just one.
I, rarely--and I know I can count on one hand the number of times I have responded to Direct- or Personal Messages--respond to such messages. Nor will I start responding to them in the future. Got a question? Post it in a thread. Got a problem? Post it in a thread. Got a request for information? Post it in a thread.
Get it? Want something? Post it in a thread. Don't send a Direct Message or Personal Message asking for help for your individual problem. !!! DON'T DO IT !!! If you don't want your Manager or Supervisor or colleague(s) to see that you posted for help on a World Wide Web forum, use a fake name. Again, Control.com isn't a place for anyone to find personal help with a problem or a request for information. It's a pubic forum--where many people can share information and provide help and learn. Sure, individuals can get help with their problems or requests--but that same help benefits many people, over a long time.
Last--if you have a question about something you read or thought you read or perceived in an existing thread--you can always post to that thread for clarification. If you have something you feel is unique and you didn't find your question or a suitable answer to your question, post it in new thread.
Back to our regularly scheduled programming.
Yesterday morning, I received (yet) another Direct/Personal Message from someone via Control.com, someone named Taza. It is the SECOND time he wrote via Direct/Personal Messsage for help with the SAME problem. Anyway, he wrote:
"Mark VIe control system is new for me.
One GT controllers ( TMR ) are showing Not Equal Sign and not allowing to force any signal.
Can you help me out, how to resolve this issue."
Taza,
It's unclear what the application is (turbine--gas or steam; DCS/BOP; etc.), or what kind of Mark VIe you are working on (a Mark VIe, or a Mark V-to-Mark VIe Life Extension, or a Mark VI-to-Mark VIe platform upgrade, etc.). The differences ARE important.
It's also unclear exactly where the "Not Equal Sign" is appearing. A screen capture or screen shot or a CLEAR photograph posted to a proper thread--NOT A DIRECT- OR PRIVATE MESSAGE--would be very helpful. In fact, with regard to your problem: Some more information--which could be clearly shown in a screen shot or CLEAR photo--is absolutely necessary.
Lastly, why the HELL do you need to force anything???!?!!!?!?! If you're new to Mark VIe, then you probably shouldn't be forcing anything, and someone is probably telling you that something needs to be forced or had been forced in the past. And how do you know that person is correct? How do you know that what you are forcing is the proper way to deal with the issue which is occurring? Did you force something before to solve an issue? And now you think you need to force that same thing again? If you, or someone, forced something before to solve a "similar" (or even the same) issue--tell us that information.
Are you using the same HMI as before to force this thing which just must be forced? If not, why not? Tell us as much information about the situation and circumstances as possible.
I hear this all the time: "The LAST time this happened, we had to force [this or that]!" On a Mark* turbine control system (which, according to many people is the root of all evil!) EVERY problem is like the LAST problem, even if it's not. (And 99.3% of the time, this problem is NOT like the LAST problem.) People just do not think about this problem, or the LAST problem--they just blame the Mark* for EVERY problem, which is just like the LAST problem. Why? Because the Mark* is SO complicated and SO user-unfriendly and SO mysterious that it must be the cause of EVERY single problem, so that makes EVERY problem which comes up just like the LAST problem.
Forcing is not the answer to every problem--or even most problems. Just like "calibrating" servos or fuel control valves is not the answer to every problem, or even most problems. Or replacing a servo when the unit tripped for no apparent reason.
Most people don't have a friggin' clue about GE-design heavy duty gas turbine systems and devices and operation and operating and control philosophy. (That's somewhat understandable; GE documentation is pretty bad, but it's not horrible--not always, anyway.) They don't refer to P&IDs--many won't even try (which is surprising because GE P&IDs are about the simplest and best P&IDs around). All of which makes the Mark* even more of a monster and the cause of all problems. Everything (well, not everything, but most everything) is connected to the Mark*, right? So, it must be the cause of all problems--and because the Mark* is the cause of all problems then EVERY problem is like the LAST problem and it can be fixed or worked around or ignored by forcing something. That is the popular, but mostly untrue, belief.
There are any number of reasons why a not equal sign might appear in different places in ToolboxST (which is NOT the Mark VIe--ToolboxST is just the application which is used to program, monitor and troubleshoot the Mark VIe). If there's a not equal sign somewhere, then someone has done something they shouldn't have--and without understanding what was done, it's very difficult to be of much help. BUT, a CLEAR picture or a screen shot attached to a thread would go a LONG ways towards beginning to be able to provide some help.
To Taza and everyone else reading this thread:
To receive help with any issue or request for information you need to open a proper thread in Control.com. YES, I know--the number of possible forums is intimidating and because there is little moderation--and because the moderators can't know precisely where every thread should be placed--threads sometimes end up in the most unlikely of forums and areas. Just pick a forum. If it's egregiously wrong, a moderator will move it (though I can count on one hand the number of threads I know of which have been moved in 15 years--it rarely happens, or if it does it's not made widely known to the readers of the forum). So, pick a forum--a good one for this question would be "Control Systems and HMIs" or "Power" or, if the turbine is a generator drive for a power plant, "Utilities." But, pick one--and post your question there.
Why? Because the Direct- or Personal Message feature of the new Control.com IS NOT FOR FINDING YOUR OWN PERSONAL FREE SOURCE OF HELP AND INFORMATION! By being selfish and posting your request for help to someone using the Direct- or Personal Messaging feature of Control.com you are depriving others of the information you are asking for. That's one of the very best things about forums like Control.com--the fact that prior threads and questions and requests for information are all archived and can be searched and valuable information can be found. And, the thing that makes Control.com such a valuable forum among so many other similar forums is that people write back with feedback to let others know if the information provided to them was useful or not. That way, when others read the thread--now or in the future--they will know what worked and what didn't.
By writing directly to someone and asking for help with your question you are preventing others from seeing the information and the chance to learn from it and use it. AND, the individual who might answer your question is spending his/her time writing an individual response that will never be seen or shared by others. And, most of us get paid exactly the same amount as you paid when you post your question to Control.com: Nothing. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Niente. Why would anyone waste his/her time and effort on one person when the same amount of time and effort can help many people? I'm not here to be anyone's personal mentor or guide or guru or instructor, when I can be that to many people. The goal here is to help people--but to help many people, not just one.
I, rarely--and I know I can count on one hand the number of times I have responded to Direct- or Personal Messages--respond to such messages. Nor will I start responding to them in the future. Got a question? Post it in a thread. Got a problem? Post it in a thread. Got a request for information? Post it in a thread.
Get it? Want something? Post it in a thread. Don't send a Direct Message or Personal Message asking for help for your individual problem. !!! DON'T DO IT !!! If you don't want your Manager or Supervisor or colleague(s) to see that you posted for help on a World Wide Web forum, use a fake name. Again, Control.com isn't a place for anyone to find personal help with a problem or a request for information. It's a pubic forum--where many people can share information and provide help and learn. Sure, individuals can get help with their problems or requests--but that same help benefits many people, over a long time.
Last--if you have a question about something you read or thought you read or perceived in an existing thread--you can always post to that thread for clarification. If you have something you feel is unique and you didn't find your question or a suitable answer to your question, post it in new thread.
Back to our regularly scheduled programming.
